Who's Really the BOSS?

There may be errors in spelling, grammar, and accuracy in this machine-generated transcript.

Rachel Dillon: Hi, I'm Rachel Dillon, and together with my husband, Marcus Dillon, we lead Who's Really the Boss podcast, where we highlight the joys and challenges of running a business with your spouse or family. Our mission is to strengthen families and businesses by helping listeners avoid the mistakes.We have made so they can lead. And live happily ever after.

Rachel Dillon: Welcome back to another [00:00:30] episode of Who's Really the Boss podcast.

Marcus Dillon: Hey, thanks for.Having me back.

Rachel Dillon: So on a recently recorded episode, you totally shared my real age with every single listener in the whole world. So because of that, you know, for the longest time I just told everyone I was 29 and people just assumed it was somewhere close to that. Like they probably didn't truly believe it was 29, but [00:01:00] they probably thought within a couple of years, now that we have a high school graduate and another daughter who's about to graduate, that's probably less believable. Um, anyway, but since you said it out loud this week, our conversation will be about kind of the differences in business ownership in our 30s versus business ownership in our 40s. So it's [00:01:30] still hard to say that we're over 40, but we'll let it go.

Marcus Dillon: I think, to give you some credit there as well. It's just a number, right?

Rachel Dillon: You're you're old people say.

Marcus Dillon: Okay, um, but it is it is just a number. It doesn't make us love you any less or anything. Um, you do get confused with being with our daughters a lot. They think [00:02:00] that you're either a cousin or a sister, but you're not always taken as. Oh, that's the mom. That never happens to me. It's like when the four of us are together, it's just like, oh, yeah, that guy, he's got to be the dad. Like, you know, but sometimes there is question and who is this other person that's with this family?

Rachel Dillon: Yeah, I know I that's that is very, um. Nice to hear on occasion [00:02:30] when people ask if I'm the sister. Typically I feel like that's in like a commissioned setting. So when we're out shopping, the salesperson may say that and I'm like, do you work on commission or are you really saying that since I don't look like the girls at all? Um, that also might be why that you had the girls look very similar to each other. Um, y'all are all about 5 to 6in taller than me. Um, all look pretty much the same. And then there's me, [00:03:00] who looks completely different than everyone else. So. Yeah. Um, but it is flattering to hear every once in a while that maybe I look somewhere closer to their age than closer to your age. So that's nice.

Marcus Dillon: So when tips and commission are involved, potentially that gets said right. Yes.

Rachel Dillon: That the frequency with which that gets said definitely increases. And so thinking back though, because we are now so mature.

Marcus Dillon: Into this next chapter.

Rachel Dillon: And, and have been [00:03:30] in business ownership actually you started in business ownership in your 20s. So how old were you when you purchased the block of clients?

Marcus Dillon: Well, 28 when the entity was formed, I think 29 it was right around my birthday when the deal was done. So.

Rachel Dillon: Okay. So before before you were 30. Oh yeah. But you were in business ownership the entire decade of your 30s. Um, and then now have continued on into this new decade [00:04:00] of 40s. And so just wanted to talk through what have been some of the differences early in the career of business ownership and then what that looks like today?

Marcus Dillon: I'm so much more tired now. Um, that.

Rachel Dillon: Is not evident by the initiatives and the experiments and the things new that we continue to.

Marcus Dillon: Start and do. Um, I work for Joy now. Right. And it's a little bit easier to enjoy what you do versus have to do. But definitely [00:04:30] when we started the business in early 30s, it was the half to do. And you just need energy to do that. I told myself that if I was going to make the leap and buy a firm, I was going to do that in my 20s or as soon as I could, because if that business failed, which you never know, um, I could always go back to work and recover. I had more time to recover, or if I stayed too long in a firm, and it was evident I didn't want to be a part of that firm any [00:05:00] longer or be a partner. I didn't want to restart in my 40s. That's what I told myself. My 40s. I didn't want to go buy a firm in my 40s, or I didn't want to restart my 40s. And now that I'm in my 40s, it doesn't like it's not as bad as I thought. Like people that start firms in their 40s, maybe even their 50s, like, you know, it's not bad.

Rachel Dillon: Um, I think we had an unrealistic picture of what our 40s were going to be like. And maybe all younger people have that. Like, [00:05:30] I didn't even know if I was going to be alive at 40. I really thought the end came when I was like holding on to 29 for so long. I remember being devastated when I turned 25 that I was getting old. And so this has been an ongoing battle. Um, but potentially because our parents worked so hard and they really were exhausted in their 40s. Um, so maybe just lifestyle and things that we did as younger adults has made this [00:06:00] change.

Marcus Dillon: I think the other thing to keep in mind is, you know, we we are high school sweethearts and got married really young, had kids, really young. So we in our.

Rachel Dillon: 20s.

Marcus Dillon: In our early 20s. Yeah. Um, so I think we also we've always hung out with people that have been a decade older than us. I feel just because of where we are life wise, that all of our friends are about 8 to 10 years older than us, and I [00:06:30] feel like we did that in business as well. I, you know, started the business in her 20s. Most people probably started in their 30s after they've got career. They probably use that same logic. And having kids like they had, they enjoyed their 20s and then they had kids in their 30s. So, um, but yeah, we started in our 20s, so was a business owner the whole decade of the 30s. And what I, what I saw is a lot of maturity there. And if you if you also parallel [00:07:00] that to raising kids, like we kind of grew up with our kids because we had them at 22, 23 and we got to just say, hey, we're young and dumb as our excuse. Uh, we didn't know any better as we made mistakes, but everybody's going to make mistakes. So I think it was easier to give ourselves credit for just being young and making mistakes versus being more seasoned and making those mistakes. But in actuality nobody knows, you know? So I think that's [00:07:30] the piece where in in our 30s, we had that full decade of business ownership. And if I look back to where where I made decisions or how I made decisions in my early 30s, I place less emphasis on time in in days.

Marcus Dillon: And there would always be the next day. There would always be, um, this next month. And I just got to get through what I'm doing today, or the process I'm in or the season [00:08:00] of life. And I was wishing my life away. And it's really bad now to look back and think like, okay, if like, what would it be to get back some of those years in my early 30s when I was at the office 80 hours a week, um, I kind of always said, you know, because it was our business, at least I was doing it for us, you know, and that was easy to qualify it, but still, like, that's stupid. Like, that's bad logic, bad reasoning. And you're foregoing family [00:08:30] time for over time. And that's the piece where now I grasped that. So could we do more now that we're in our early 40s? Could we have more clients? Could we have more revenue? Could we have more team members? No doubt in my mind. But what would that look like from a life style perspective? Life with our kids? Are we balancing out that better now because of what we've learned? And I'm thankful that [00:09:00] we that we were able to make that change late 30s, early 40s as opposed to late 50s, early 60s. And then, you know, my knees are completely gone and my back's all jacked up. So, yeah.

Rachel Dillon: So kind of direct comparison as far as motivations for working and motivations for making decisions early on in the business versus. Motivations and decisions that are made. You [00:09:30] know now how many ever years we're down the road. 13 years. Yeah.

Marcus Dillon: So initially in the business in the we'll just say the 30s. Right. Because I was only in it for one year in my 20s, in the 30s it was all about building, like building something that could sustain and building something that was big enough to create cash flow, to have a client base, to employ people that we wanted to employ for. For us, it had to be of a certain level. That way I could see. Modifying [00:10:00] my role in evolving my role into what I wanted it to be long terme. And for us, the way that we grew DBA was to create a big enough base to employ people. That allowed me to do other functions of the business that I wanted to do, and to get to that base, you have to put in that the time or the effort to build it. And what that meant for us was client accumulation going through the filter to see which clients were the best clients, [00:10:30] keep those best clients, exit the ones that that were not the best clients, and even build upon those relationships with the best clients. Surround those clients with a team that could care for them so much better than I could alone, and then step back and enjoy what you've created.

Marcus Dillon: And there's there's a rule of thumb or a saying it takes ten years to build a business. It takes ten years to enjoy it, and then it takes ten years to lose it. And so I think it just goes with [00:11:00] that ten years you are all in. You are extremely focused, hyper focused. And that was no different for us. So now that we're in this ten years of enjoyment, it's like, how do we fine tune it? How do we elevate others? How do we get people in the right seats, the right roles? And it's more of more more of a leadership versus a technician role for me. And then the next ten after that would be succession. What does that look like? You know, do you a lot of [00:11:30] um, a lot of people say they're going to sell their business and go work for someone, or I've got ten more years left in me, you know, or whatever they may say to themselves, if you say that, if you say you've got ten more years in, in yourself, like, what are you doing today to set yourself up for success? Because in our world, if you're going to upstream merge, which we have no interest in doing, if you're an upstream merge, you're going to go to work in that firm and you're going to have to be there for a while.

Marcus Dillon: And we've had conversations with firms over the [00:12:00] years like, we would love to acquire you to be a part of our cars division. And we we see your team and how special they are and what you've created. And we just want that as a part of this larger firm. Oh, and because of that, you're going to work because of our retirement plan. You're 40. Let's say you're going to have to make it to mandatory retirement age of 65, which is 25 more years. And I'm like, I've been doing this since I was 28. Like, I have no desire. You come to me at a 38 year old, maybe. [00:12:30] But so that's the other reason why, if you tell yourself, like, I've got ten more years to give, like, really? Is it ten or is it five, is it three? Is it none? Um, so I think those are the, the blocks that we're currently living in. And so we're in that decade of enjoyment right now and it is fun. Um, I think there are better days. More, better days than bad. Uh, there's bad moments in anything, but I think that's where we're at.

Rachel Dillon: Yeah, I know [00:13:00] something that I remember and recognized in the beginning. In the beginning, it was really the business was really all about you, about what you could produce, what you needed to produce, because ultimately what you were producing was income for our family. And there wasn't really any desire on your part, which you can tell me I'm wrong if I am, but there wasn't really any desire on your part to manage. People [00:13:30] like to manage a team, and I think that it took the realization of your you can make as much as you want as far as income, I'm just based on how much you're willing to work, like how many hours you're willing to work. And after working that many hours for a couple of seasons, I think you realize, like, okay, now I'm at capacity of this is all I can work. So if I want to do anything bigger than [00:14:00] this, I'm going to have to have a team. And so I know that early on, it felt like managing people was maybe scary or uncomfortable. Managing people doing client work was where your comfort level was. You were really good at it. You knew how to do it. Um, but managing people wasn't necessarily your comfort level.

Marcus Dillon: No, you have to evolve. And maturity is the word, right? Like you have to mature past what your [00:14:30] preconceived notions are around business ownership, around making enough money. Um, once you become an entrepreneur, you really believe that you're an entrepreneur. That's that's the realization is that you can make as much money as you want, like there is no cap on anything. And I would hope even more like some of our team members, team members and other firms or other businesses like that holds true. Like there's no cap. Like if you provide enough value, like money's going to come and. [00:15:00] And you just have to know when enough's enough. And the piece there, um, with the team is I saw opportunity to shift. How? Money, or how value could be brought to the market and do that with others versus. Do that with just myself. And you see some people out there that are just consultants, solopreneurs, or believe in themselves so much that they are the answer to all of their clients [00:15:30] problems. That's not us like. And it took me a while to understand that a very short while, like I think within a year I was like, I can't do it all. And that's whenever you start bringing in the right people. Knowing the right people to bring in was also another realization within the first couple of years of business. And I would say, by the time you're in your 40s, you should be really leaning into only the right people are around you. You don't have any projects around [00:16:00] you. There's not enough time left, right, um, to have projects around you. And so I think we're a really good judge of character. And if someone's going to fit within our team pretty quick and we've gotten better about how to identify that, and I think that's part of what we learned in our 30s about people and who do we want on this journey with us for the next decade, decades, um, as we go along. Yeah.

Rachel Dillon: I think a realization [00:16:30] for you, too, um, just in getting older, in maturing, was that. Yes. Providing a service or at that time even a commodity of a tax return? Yes, that was helpful. But the impact that you could really have didn't really live past that tax return or that tax season. Like once that one need was fulfilled, then what? Like you wait till the next year before you're able to have a positive impact again. And so I think just as [00:17:00] you mature and as you evolve, you start to realize that, I mean, this is so apparent, but that people matter most. And so how you can influence and positively impact people, um, is really what's important is really what brings satisfaction and fulfillment in the day. And so then being able to move from that, I just want to put my head down and do really good work and go home to [00:17:30] now your days, your best days are spent with team members. You know, in meetings. That's typically what the setting looks like because it's work. It's during the business day, but with team members or with clients, which were two things that you really didn't care to do in the beginning, because both of those things would slow you down from getting the actual work done that you were trying to do.

Marcus Dillon: Yeah, I think, uh, very early on, you're spot on. Slow me down. Like, get out of my way, [00:18:00] get off the call as soon as I can. I got to crank through this tax churn, get the invoice out, get paid, move on to the next. That's how I thought. And so it started to evolve. Whenever you see beyond that and we I think kind of the spark for advisory for me was doing a tax churn. And as something as simple as, hey, you should talk to your bank, your lender about why you're paying mortgage insurance premiums, your value, the [00:18:30] value of your home has probably gone up to where you can drop these MIP that you're paying every year. And we could do that with a 1040. I remember doing that with like our most basic 1040 client. They were paying MIP and on their form 1098 I could see some different things. And just knowing what their house is probably worth, I'm like, hey, you're probably over, uh, that percentage now where you could drop that. And I remember adding value that way with some of those early returns and getting feedback from clients that were paying just for a tax return. They [00:19:00] weren't paying for that advice, but because I was giving it, they were receptive. They were thankful.

Marcus Dillon: And that's also the evolution. Like that's what people pay for. They pay for a relationship. They pay for advice. Learning that earlier in my career versus later has been helpful. Um, I think a lot of people are now fully into knowing why advisory and relationships are are valuable, and that was a big thing to learn in my 30s to where now my 40s. The great thing around [00:19:30] being in in this decade, most of your friends, most of your circle of influence are decision makers. And so when I was in my 20s, I wished I prayed for gray hair, and I remember I wanted to look older so our older clients would respect me and take me more seriously. And they wouldn't downplay me as like a 20 year old kid who thought he knew what he was doing. So in my 30s, right, I started to develop some of those [00:20:00] features that, uh, age you. And now that I'm in my 40s, I fully have those features that age you. And part of that is the rest of your peer group is. Also a decision maker and they respect what you say just because stage of life. And I you need to embrace that in your 40s because you may not have had that in your 20s or 30s.

Rachel Dillon: Yeah, yeah. So back in the day you would have paid to have gray hair and now you pay to have [00:20:30] Botox. So they come full circle, right?

Marcus Dillon: It's all the filters. The smoothness looks great.

Rachel Dillon: I think something else too, that changes from beginning of the career to, you know, we'll say middle, middle of the career that changes after years of owning a business, thinking that you have to do things a certain way because that's the way it's all we'll say always in quotes, always been done versus trying [00:21:00] new things, stepping out, doing things that work either for your family or your team versus what the industry. Uh, you know, on average does.

Marcus Dillon: Yeah. I think the, the main thing there is constant evolution through trying new things and knowing how long to give experiments because as the sand goes through the hourglass, right. Like you have less sand to give. So [00:21:30] being very disciplined to set a timeline, to know when to move beyond an experiment. And I think if you break it down in decades and you say, okay, the 30s is about the on ramp and you're you're just trying to get on to the on ramp and, and build speed. 40s is about maintaining speed, kind of constant motion. And then 50 is going to be that off ramp. And so as you're exiting that off ramp, you're thinking about what do I want my succession to look like. What is what is the exit truly need to be? Because [00:22:00] if you have disregard for each of these chapters, which are natural chapters to have in life and in business, you may get to the end of the day. I just saw it. Uh, an 82 year old dentist was looking to sell his practice, and all the other dentists in this forum were laughing like, because who is his client base? 82 years old? Are you going to have a person operating in your mouth at 82? Probably not. And so the remaining patient [00:22:30] base that he had was so small, so minimal that you at 82, what options you have are truly limited. And if you want to be more in control, if you actually want to drive your career, want to drive your business, paying attention to the different chapters, the milestones, the, the. Roadmarks whatever. Like that's where you need to be and giving yourself advantages throughout and then being [00:23:00] in the driver's seat in more control.

Rachel Dillon: So yeah, I think something for that's important for us to remember is that when we are younger there there are a lot of learning opportunities. There's so much to learn, there's so much to figure out, there's so much to experiment with. But as we learn from those things and as we mature, then it's our responsibility to share that learning with other people. And so whatever [00:23:30] age that comes, whether you start super early in that maturity starts happening in your 30s or maybe later in life, but always to give back so that you can continue, right, that evolution. And people aren't starting from the same point over and over and over again year after year.

Marcus Dillon: Yeah. And I think that's that's where we're completely at in our 40s. And that's where it's it's getting the most fun, almost like a completely new chapter of a new book being written to where [00:24:00] all the excitement, all the build of sharing what we've learned with others and getting ROI on the mistakes and the failed experiments that we exited. Now we can actually build upon that and help others, whether they're internal or external, to have a better outlook for their own business, for their own firm and own life.

Rachel Dillon: Yeah. Any other thoughts to share on what business ownership looked like in your 30s versus what it looks like in our 40s?

Marcus Dillon: In your 30s, you're just you're [00:24:30] moving fast. Um, you have to give yourself you have to build in pause, like you have to give yourself rest, rest stations, whatever you want to call it, to actually force yourself to stop, look around, make sure you're still going the right direction. Like, is this the path that you want to continue going, or is there something else that is calling you as far as opportunity? And I think in your 30s, hopefully you're building momentum, [00:25:00] you're setting money aside to be financially stable or, um, that builds to where in your 40s, hopefully you are truly financially independent like you are, to the point where you are no longer relying on anybody else outside of your own individual asset base to create value and worth. And so I think that's where you build to and hopefully in your 40s, you get that to where then your 50s, your exit could be a little bit more [00:25:30] stable, a little bit more unique and personalized to what you want it to look like, as opposed to following somebody else's design plan. Um, and so that's where I would leave people like 30s. You got to build in stops. Probably not bad to continue those stops in 40s and 40s. It's all about surrounding yourself with others. So hopefully in your 30s you're starting to feel out who your network is. 40s, you're fully built out and surrounding yourself, [00:26:00] investing in others and then 50s, I don't know, hopefully it's coasting. Hopefully it's a lot better than 30s.

Rachel Dillon: I will just say at 41 now, my outlook for 50 is a lot better than when I was 25. And my outlook for again, I really didn't think I'd make it past 40. So, um, I'm I'm excited to see what the next decade holds and even beyond.

Marcus Dillon: Yeah, I know it's, uh, it's a good conversation. It's good to think about.

Rachel Dillon: All right. Thanks for [00:26:30] hanging with us to the end of another episode. Leave us a review with your thoughts, comments, and feedback on Apple Podcasts or Spotify. Be sure to subscribe to our podcast so you don't miss any future episodes. Join us again next week for another great conversation.