Who's Really the BOSS?

There may be errors in spelling, grammar, and accuracy in this machine-generated transcript.

Rachel Dillon: Hi, I'm Rachel Dillon, and together with my husband, Marcus Dillon, we lead Who's Really the Boss podcast, where we highlight the joys and challenges of running a business with your spouse or family. Our mission is to strengthen families and businesses by helping listeners avoid the mistakes we have made so they can lead.And live happily ever after.

Rachel Dillon: Welcome back to [00:00:30] another episode of Who's Really the Boss podcast.

Marcus Dillon: Hey, thanks for having me back.

Rachel Dillon: Well, I welcomed you to the podcast, but I should have welcomed everyone to Amateur Hour because we are talking about marketing and sales for accounting firms. We probably do a much better job at marketing and sales for bakeries or clothing, but, uh. Our main job is accounting firms and serving clients [00:01:00] through accounting and tax and advisory services. And so really just talking through today, we've had a lot of, um, questions and interests. We are always interested in what what should we be doing as far as marketing and advertising and sales for our clients? Um, one, because we want to provide high value, highly relational services, we want to have [00:01:30] deep relationships with our clients. Our team wants to have deep relationships with their clients, not just transactions and commodities. And so I think that's what makes this even more important than, say, if we were just providing 1040 tax service. I feel like that's I won't say it's easy. I'll just say we've been able to attract a lot more clients, individual clients for a [00:02:00] 1040 tax return than, say, a full suite of accounting, tax and advisory services for a small business.

Marcus Dillon: Yeah, the the marketing terminology is escaping me at this minute. Um, but you just have a larger pool of buyers for a 1040. Then you do for all inclusive white glove accounting services that are priced $2,000 and above. So I think, um, you have to give yourself some credit. It's [00:02:30] highly relational. What we do, what most of our listeners do, and it's a longer sales cycle. Obviously they know that. Now, the other piece there is um, marketing. Whenever I put my CFO hat on for a client, I zoom in on the advertising and marketing line item because usually that's where I can find some cost savings. Um, usually I can help determine a budget for the client. Um, depending on what their growth initiatives are, where they want to go. [00:03:00] And then I also look back to see how long they've been paying the same amount of money to the same marketing agency or SEO services. And how do we measure results? So putting on the CFO hat, that's something I always evaluate because there could be an opportunity to scale down if we've already gotten the bump that we have with that company, or increase depending on if there's zero budget, and then maybe they have a faster way to [00:03:30] grow with what they're trying to solve for, too. So, um, but yeah, taking off the CFO hat now, putting back on the business owner hat, uh, we get a lot of questions about who does, you know, our marketing, who does our social media. And whenever you said, welcome to Amateur Hour, I kind of think that's a little bit unfair. Uh, to to you and to the team behind you that encourages you because you're the main person that does a lot of that for us.

Rachel Dillon: We're gonna we're gonna really focus on [00:04:00] marketing and advertising to our ideal clients, which goes beyond just posting on social media or sending out an email. Um, for example, before we can post on social media and send out an email, we have to know who we're sending it to. And so I say amateur because there are words like sales funnels and bow tie and, um, different acronyms and abbreviations that I have no [00:04:30] idea what they actually mean. Or maybe I know what they mean, but I don't really know what they mean to me. Um, in my day to day. So we're going to go super basic today and just start with, how do we even create things for social media or for an email? The first thing that we have to do is identify our ideal client. The first thing we have to identify is who are we talking to? And this is not my own [00:05:00] idea. I have seen this over and over again, but you can't talk to everyone. Your best thought is to talk to one person. So currently, maybe if this isn't something that you've spent a lot of time on in your firm is thinking about your best client like the one you would want to clone over and over and over and over again, and then thinking about what you would want to tell that one person, either currently, or maybe what you were telling that person [00:05:30] when they came to you. And so starting with ideal clients.

Marcus Dillon: Yeah. Um, so what are you selling? Right. And who are you selling it to? Uh. Or who are you serving? Uh, sale. That could be a negative connotation. It's usually not. Um, once you get your mind wrapped around that, it is truly around service. But the the having the avatar or your ideal client in mind, even naming that person, uh, I spend some time with [00:06:00] some ADP, uh, representatives and ADP as big of a company as they are. I think they issue one in every six payroll checks in the country, which is quite a bit. Everybody else is much smaller. Um, their executives all the way down to their field service reps. Their field reps, um, have in mind their customer and they call him, I believe Alex and Alex owns a pizza shop on the corner in every small town. And [00:06:30] I think even having that visualization of Alex and the family that owns that pizza shop, you know how you're going to approach this person whenever they come in to buy from you, or how you market your services to that person? So if if ADP thinks about it that way and they're this global engine sales organization that is number one in all their different categories, then why can't we think about it that same way?

Rachel Dillon: Yeah, absolutely. So who [00:07:00] would you say is our ideal client?

Marcus Dillon: Yeah, our ideal client is a doctor owner. So owns their own practice. And their practice is anywhere from 1 million to 3 million. Really? It could be 1.5 to 3 million is, like, truly the sweet spot. They've got a team of 20 or less. And typically it's a family practice. So that means that they have a spouse or another family member in the office or working alongside [00:07:30] them doing some functionality. And they're to the point in their career, their life where they want to delegate, they want to delegate some of the responsibilities of owning a business to others, whether they're looking for an associate to kind of help on the production side, but then also they're trying to remove some of the work off of maybe the spouse who also works in the business in an office type role. So that's our ideal candidate. Um, you [00:08:00] see that a lot. And it's the next question is, once we've identified who that is, where do those people hang out and who is their circle of influence? And I think we've tried to imagine and reimagine that, uh, as life throws different curveballs at you. I mean, that was one way of reaching those ideal clients or ideal prospects. Prior to Covid. Covid was a weird season. And then now on the other side [00:08:30] of COVID, you kind of have to adapt because it'll never go back to what it was pre. Um, so some of the things that we would do aligning ourselves with others who had more touch points with that prospect, so, um, different, whether it was dental vet, the different service reps that are in those offices, um, catering to those doctors and their team.

Marcus Dillon: Um, those are who we would try to support and then be on their good side so that whenever [00:09:00] a pain point came up, we were the first in mind. Um, as a recommendation. And then, you know, the other piece is, um, our ideal client. I think you mentioned this the other day. They have to be in their office to be making money so they don't hang out on LinkedIn during the day. They don't hang out at the country club during the day. They are in their office chair side typically, or with their team to make [00:09:30] money. And so how do you meet them? Where they're at or stay top of mind. And that's how you have to go to them. So like those are the questions that you have to ask yourself once you've identified who your ideal client is, where do they hang out? Who are their circles of influence? Who has more touch points with them than you? And then if they do hang out at the country club, how how do you get in front of them whenever they are at the country club and maybe not thinking about their business? So all of those [00:10:00] questions have to get answered.

Rachel Dillon: And so thinking through all of that, let's go back a little bit. And how did we land on the doctor owner? So a doctor, a dentist, a veterinarian owner with a practice anywhere between 1 and 3 to 5 million in revenue. How did we land on that? I don't have any physicians or medical I do now, but growing up, like my [00:10:30] my immediate family, parents and grandparents are not doctors. Sinister vets. Um, your family doesn't have that either. And neither one of us really went. You didn't go down a medical path. I went down a little bit of a medical path, uh, in college. But how did we land on that?

Marcus Dillon: I went down a little bit of a medical path and then saw the side of blood and got as as white as a ghost in that class, and determined a medical path [00:11:00] was not the path for me.

Rachel Dillon: One week is not down a path you like. Peered into the path and were like, nope, not for me. That one's not going to be mine.

Marcus Dillon: When I pass out in my, uh, my first class, so good stuff. Um, but yeah.

Rachel Dillon: How did we land on that?

Marcus Dillon: So a few different things. Like we, we liked the team size. We like what those businesses were trying to achieve in their communities and for their families. So it aligned with what we were trying to do. Um, [00:11:30] you compare that to like, a corporation where no one's got a stake in it. Maybe they have some ownership. We knew what we didn't like just as much as what we wanted to like. And so while we don't have the, you know, medical background or even some of the other professional services that we support, like that specific technical knowledge, we do have about the same size team in our business. And so what we are doing, we [00:12:00] can experiment on ourselves or businesses like ourselves and apply what we've learned to those type of clients that are in that same range. And the other piece that we like there is with medical, especially, as you mentioned, like dentists, vets, they're trying to get back to their community. They're doing that through the family atmosphere of trying to support a team. Um, they're they're constantly overwhelmed because they were not taught, uh, business [00:12:30] 101 class throughout their education. Even as long as they do go to school. So usually they could use our help and then even the revenue standpoint 1 to 3 million, they can afford our services. So I think that's the piece where you kind of back into who this ideal client is, or at least we did, um, through a process of elimination. But then also finally, who who can pay the fees that you need given the team of how you're going to serve that client?

Rachel Dillon: Yeah. [00:13:00] And if you remember back to the very early days, we actually looked at our client list by industry. So back when we were providing mostly annual only tax returns, we looked at our client list and then we looked to see what industries did we serve more of just what had a higher percentage of of common industries and that fit there. What we also looked at, just besides to see, you know, what our client makeup was, was [00:13:30] looking at who could we add value to. So looking at opportunities of things that this type of client was missing out on because they didn't have someone advising them in this way, They are constantly in their office or out in the community, out with their family. They're not sitting with other professional professionals, like seeking advice or taking time out of their day to go get advice on things. They're kind of asking friends, um, usually [00:14:00] other dentists, um, kind of best advice or what have you done? And then they just go do the same thing that that person did, whether it makes sense for their practice or not, whether it makes sense for their financial goals or not.

Rachel Dillon: If somebody, a friend did it, they're going to do it too. Or, you know, if someone has success with it, they're going to assume they're going to have success with it, too, and not really pay attention to the maybe tax consequences that come with it or financial consequences as far as cash flow. And so that's what we really looked at. Who can we add value [00:14:30] to? Who are we already serving well. And then also it happened that this ideal client has a business very similar to ours, not in what we provide but in the makeup. And the challenges are similar because team challenges come up because cash flow challenges can be present. Um, because looking at succession and partners and associates and multiple locations, all of those same things are similar [00:15:00] from business to business. And so while they do have expertise in a medical area, you also and our team has expertise in financial and business ownership that we could directly, immediately pour into them without having to go out and learn a new skill set to be able to provide value to these people.

Marcus Dillon: Yeah, and I think you hit on so much there. Um, part of when we scanned, [00:15:30] like our client list, it did seem like we had these concentrations built up in certain industries, but we also had certain industries where we had concentrations like construction, where we knew we could have gone down that path. But there was also lack of standardization in those industries to where every construction company looks different and how they price what they build. Like there's just such [00:16:00] a variety that we knew the business that we wanted to build had some consistency in it, and with that, we needed to pick a consistent industry. And that's why we looked at dentistry, vet other medical practices where we could build up, okay, their biggest cost is labor people, and we can speak into that. And we feel called to speak into people ministry, if you will. And so I think that's the other piece where I love construction, I love real [00:16:30] estate. And we still have a few very special clients that I serve, but they're more friends. Um, they are not something that we've standardized or scaled. Um, and that's a decision because we knew as we built out our business that we had to have some of those duplicate principles and procedures in place for client, for client work. So all of that was kind of the process. And [00:17:00] just because you have 1 or 2 clients in a separate industry doesn't mean that's a bad thing. But who are you going to market to? And so that's where we made the decision. Like, okay, we can go to market and actually speak to every doctor on the corner in, in rural America or on the city street in Houston, Texas. And we we probably know most of the pain points that they have. And [00:17:30] so that's why we made that choice. And because we spoke to that audience, that's eventually who continued to come into our practice because we weren't speaking to real estate or construction industries. They weren't really finding us that way. So that was that was the other piece that we saw and why we made that motion to go that way.

Rachel Dillon: Yeah, absolutely. So once you've identified [00:18:00] or created this ideal client or this avatar, then we need to attract them. So again going super basic on kind of marketing and advertising, we need to attract our ideal client. So if we've had just an influx of individuals, but now we want to go after business owners and really add value, only accept clients who are business owners that fit this ideal client persona. [00:18:30] How do we go about attracting that person? We don't necessarily have to, depending on the volume, you know, turn off or turn away everyone else. But we definitely do need to target the ideal.

Marcus Dillon: Yeah. The the best thing for me. Um, and when we've been fortunate as you, as you mentioned, like we already had some of the concentration in our ideal client profile because we had [00:19:00] so many client relationships that we had gathered throughout the year that we didn't know what to do with them. And then so when we started getting really specific on what industries we liked working with, we already had some of those industries. Maybe the listener only has one of those clients, and even if you only have one, you're so much better off than if you didn't have that person. So what I would recommend is go spend time with that one person. Usually I have found whenever we're in [00:19:30] like a dry season as far as like prospects and, um, potential new clients coming our way, I've had to remind myself that in order for me to receive good prospects and clients, I need to take care of my existing prospects and clients that are in those industries. And so if you take those clients to lunch, make them feel special. Go, go take them to a C event. So like dental, they have to get [00:20:00] continuing education. No different than CPAs and lawyers and everything like that. So if you could take them or go with them to a C key event, drive them, take them to lunch before or after whatever it is you're in the room with all of your other ideal clients and you're on the arm, so to speak, of one of their peers.

Marcus Dillon: So like it's it's an inroad, like you just were let into the club whether you know it or not. So, um, the [00:20:30] other thing, by spending time with them, you know, what their pain points are. And so maybe you've only got one, maybe you've got multiple people you can kind of bounce around from and learn learn from, but that's usually the best place to start. And then from there you start to document like what questions are they asking? What pain points do they have? What what is just the conversation? And as you build up the conversation, you can turn that conversation and have it exactly with the other peers [00:21:00] in the room, because they all everybody kind of thinks the same way in those industries. And it's it, it builds. And then that way you become the trusted person in the room and you don't get crazy and start to sell. Day one, you're just there to listen and to be a friend. And eventually they'll they'll come your way. That's what we've seen work for us.

Rachel Dillon: Yeah, absolutely. I love that spending time with your ideal client [00:21:30] that you already have identified or that you already have in your care. Um, I would say even with that, you're going to take those conversations and build your email campaigns, your social posts off the information that you learned from those people. But even more so than that, what we did, um, and this is a little bit tailored to exactly our ideal client and a little bit tailored to just what every business owner would need. [00:22:00] But putting together those packages of services. So a suite of services that adds value. So what you're doing by getting to know that ideal client and their pain points or their challenges is really finding out where can you add value to them, and then putting it in a package of services to present, um, and being able to productize that package so that it has an easy name and it's easily identifiable, [00:22:30] meaning you can easily list out what's included with that service. The client can list it out, your team can list it out. Anybody can say the name of that package. Ours are called essential, Premier and Elite. But when we say those three words, everyone knows exactly what that includes and exactly what that means. That's just going to be easier for anyone to talk about you and talk about your services in order to continue to attract the ideal client? [00:23:00]

Marcus Dillon: Yeah. And I think the other the other thing that you have to do is you have to look in the mirror to see how, like, what type of business you're building. Are you building something where you want a team around you eventually? Do you not want to be a production asset in the business? And so some of that should also drive the decisions as you're making these packages, if you will. Um, if you were a solo and you were okay being a solo, um, kind of owner and production asset in your business, [00:23:30] you could go down some really cool paths, uh, to, to meet your ideal client where they need to be. And this isn't what we're called to do and what we want to do, but, I mean, how cool would it be, like if you wanted to work with doctors, medical professionals who are usually busy 8 to 5? You structure your business to be available when they're available, so maybe 5 to 10 on nights and you work weekends. Now, that may not fit what others want to do, but if you offered that up into the world [00:24:00] and you kind of had this like CPA doctor hotline, it could totally be a viable business and we're not going to do it.

Marcus Dillon: So you go steal it and own it as your own. But, uh, you know, I think that's the piece where who do you feel called to serve? But then the second step is like, as you build these packages, who's going to be serving that ideal client and in what capacity? And that that may be the existing team you have, or looking at the future team that you want to create. [00:24:30] And by doing that, you know, as you think through that, like, what can you do today and what can you delegate tomorrow? And I think as you start to build out the service offerings, these packages, bringing others in to the conversation also has to be a part of it that you don't miss, right? Because if you are building something all around yourself and you're the main relationship with this ideal client and you don't hand them [00:25:00] off appropriately to others within your team, then that could be detrimental to the relationship.

Rachel Dillon: Yeah, that's a really good point for both. Choosing your ideal client and creating your ideal services is considering the complexity and what talent pool you have to help you with that complexity. So choosing something that's so complex that only a very small [00:25:30] subset of the population can work on or can do, um, choosing services that only a very small you just kind of have to think future, um, and be very intentional, intentional about attracting even the right team members. Also, at that point, not just your ideal client, because capacity could become an issue at some point. And so that was another factor that we didn't mention earlier, was complexity was in there because we knew we weren't creating a business that just [00:26:00] you were the only production or the main production person in. We were actually creating a team, um, more like a traditional business, not a solopreneur, um, situation. So that's a really good point.

Marcus Dillon: Yeah. And I think the other piece you also have to determine is the voice of the business. And we've gone through a couple different, uh, exercises on this that were consultant led, and then we've led some internally, and then we've even asked this question of our [00:26:30] clients occasionally. So if, if your business was speaking to a room of your ideal clients, who is the actor on stage that is speaking to that ideal group of clients, and that's the persona that your business adopts. And we usually choose an actor because most of us know the variety of actors. Maybe it's somebody else, maybe it's somebody, you know, you know, like a grandparent or something. But [00:27:00] typically it's an actor or somebody famous and they're delivering this list of services to the room of your ideal prospect. So based on that person and how they deliver is also how you write all your communication and how you start to interact with your your client base or your prospect base. And so for us, I'm the only male on the team, right. So if they go into DBA and [00:27:30] client service somewhere along the way, they are no longer going to be served by a male. Right. And so we've had to kind of adopt and think through like who even the voice of DBA is. And do you you know who that is right now? I mean, you want to share who that is for us.

Rachel Dillon: I can't we talked through a bunch and I just remember saying, I, I think I said for me, it would I don't remember if we agreed on it. Um, anyway, for me it would be like Reese Witherspoon, [00:28:00] who was like just very trustworthy, um, very kind and friendly and approachable, but also gets things done, very successful. Um has value to share with other people, but other people look to that person as like a trusted source, um, and like a friendly, like somebody they want to be around, want to hang out with.

Marcus Dillon: Yeah. No, you're exactly right. You know, Reese Witherspoon is obviously our avatar. And so it's good [00:28:30] because you're, you know, you're doing the majority of this that you're writing, uh, with her in mind.

Rachel Dillon: Good thing I got the answer, right.

Marcus Dillon: Yeah, yeah. So and and we talk through that, you know, and we went through this exercise with a consulting group. You kind of throw out the wild, you know, like, I want our business to be Matthew McConaughey. And then it's like, no, you don't like, you know, this is the reason why. And so it's there's a variety of reasons that we chose Reese Witherspoon. Obviously, she's from the South. She's a female. She [00:29:00] is successful. She presents really well. Um, and typically like that is the same of our team, right. Like the ladies that lead the production. Um, for diva, like they are going to present that same way. So we want the voice to match the service that the prospect will receive once they're a client.

Rachel Dillon: Yeah, and I don't know if she's necessarily my favorite actress, though. Kinley's middle name is also [00:29:30] Reese, so maybe maybe there's more subconsciously there than I even know. Um, yeah. So thinking through just a little bit more, once we have that ideal client, once we have what services we're providing, then a lot of I think a lot of accounting firms are do get a lot of calls from prospects. So, um, what is that? Inbound sales. This is why I should not be having this. That's why this is like, totally amateur [00:30:00] hour. Um, on the receiving end, you're not going out and, like, door to door, um, selling or offering your services. Sharing your services. But when calls come in, who in our team takes those calls?

Marcus Dillon: Yeah. It's, uh, Reese Witherspoon. No, no, it's, uh, it is you. So. And you were right. Um, it is inbound. Is anything that's coming in right? Outbound would be like cold calling, going [00:30:30] and knocking on doors, going to events, um, you know, really putting yourself out there. And that's more of like a sales team or or just a rep, depending on the industry. So but inbound is typically somebody in your office and you have to be you have to be prepared for when those inbound calls come in, do they come to the person who's already overwhelmed with client work or that just doesn't want to be bothered because they have a gazillion other things [00:31:00] going on. And so them taking one more inbound call where that new prospect could be a client for you one day, that person who ultimately answers the phone also has to care about that person on the other end. And so thankful that that is you. Um, for DBA. Um, and so when you think through that, like that has evolved over the years. So those inbound calls coming in, what has helped you the most whenever receiving [00:31:30] those.

Rachel Dillon: Yeah. And so just a little bit also of context actually when someone calls our office, most likely they're going to go to voicemail, which we've learned from our medical profession friends. Right. And then we're going to call back kind of in batch like set aside time in the day when we do phone call returns and get those to the appropriate people who they need to come to. So we don't have a dedicated person just sitting and answering phones as like one of their main responsibilities. [00:32:00] But for new clients, I do take those calls, respond to those calls, respond to those emails. And the thing that has helped the most with that is knowing who our ideal client is, and knowing who our ideal client isn't, so that within just a few minutes after talking, I can help decide. Do I continue asking questions to see if they are a good fit? If they do find value in the services that we offer? [00:32:30] Or do I need to start thinking through my list of 2 or 3 referrals of who could serve them better? So knowing who our ideal client is and who it isn't is very helpful. Knowing exactly how we serve clients and being able to communicate that without having to talk to anyone else. In early days, people would call and they would say, I need an audit for something.

Rachel Dillon: And I came from teaching. I didn't even know what they were talking about. So every [00:33:00] single call I had to go ask someone in the office, do we do this? Do we do this for this person? What would we charge for something like that? Um, and so that was like typically like, I really just had to call everyone back or put them on hold and come back to the conversation because I really couldn't answer many questions. And so those two simple things of having an ideal client and having what our core services are, and knowing what our core services are not. We do not offer, [00:33:30] we do not offer an annual tax return any longer. We do not do audits. We don't serve nonprofits. Those are some really easy of like if they say that, I know immediately that I can listen to what they need, but then I'm going to start thinking through who our best referral is for what they're asking. And so those were probably easiest for me. Um, and then do you want to talk about why you don't [00:34:00] answer the phone and do those prospects? So not that you would answer the phone and, and, you know, try to route calls and do all of that, but why a prospect calls and we don't immediately forward them to you.

Marcus Dillon: Yeah. Uh, one do you remember the days whenever our cell phones you used to pay for ringtones? Now, if my cell phone makes a noise, I'm throwing it across the room, like so. How? You know how how far we've come from the days of, like, paying for ringtones all the way to. [00:34:30] My phone's been on silent for, like, 15 years. Um, so all that to say, like those calls no longer come to me just because I'm going to overcommit the whole team, like I'm always going to say, oh, yeah, we can do that. You want to help everybody, but usually you need a gatekeeper. We see this all the time in our ideal clients business. You cannot make it past that front desk to save your life. You could bring flowers, you could bring sweets, whatever you want. But [00:35:00] that how good the gatekeeper is to protect our ideal client. Um, goes a long way. And so you learn from those situations. So no different than, like in our business, whenever I actually use or occasionally would take those calls, it would always be a yes because I was motivated by an additional sale, even if it was priced incorrectly. It was more than we used to have, and that just wasn't healthy for me or the team [00:35:30] that was doing that work. So by now, having these parameters in place and different people to kind of help with the gatekeeping, I guess, if you will, um, protects not only me, but the business and the whole team. And so I think, you know, you're thinking about it from a non-owner, even though, you know, by default you are an owner of DBA. So I would always encourage people to make it to where a Non-owner could [00:36:00] be that point person that answers these calls and gives some room to discuss whether or not this is a good client for you and your business.

Rachel Dillon: Yeah. So what? What we did to allow me someone who is not from an accounting background, um, not an owner and motivated by, uh, just another sale is really put together. What questions do we need to ask? So [00:36:30] letting someone know if someone else is taking on this responsibility for them to be successful, they need to know ideal clients. They need to know what services are available, and then they need a list of questions to ask. Let that person have the discovery call and and give the yes or the no. Maybe there is one more follow up or closing conversation that needs to happen, um, with someone who is a little bit more technical, but a lot of these conversations [00:37:00] can happen and don't have to be the owner. I know when I'm talking to prospects, they can't get anyone from CPA firms to call them back. They can't get anyone to answer the phone, or someone answers and says, we'll call you back. And then they never call them back or they email and no one ever responds to email. So making sure that someone has that dedicated responsibility and then empower them to do the follow up to call and ask the questions, or to email and ask the questions to [00:37:30] be able to name off the services that would fit and to be able to determine, do we serve this type of client or not? And so that's really going to give a lot more, I guess, ownership and authority to that person who's taking those prospect calls. And one, make your business a lot better because people in the community or people who are calling are going to start seeing that you're actually responsive and your communication is better than 90% of other accounting firms. Um, and [00:38:00] then also, if you're able to have some idea of pricing for us, we say, you know, put it out there like standardize it, make it as simple and easy as possible to communicate. But some idea of pricing that that person can also communicate. So the prospect can kind of qualify or disqualify themselves based on the information that they've heard from that first line of communication.

Marcus Dillon: Yeah. And on that pricing, you can you can create just this is where our price start [00:38:30] at and how they deliver that. You can do role playing coaching calls different things like that to bring that person up to speed. The other piece, whenever it's not the owner having those conversations, you are able to see if this potential client, this prospect, um, will be able to work with someone other than the owner. And if they call the business and ask to speak to the owner. Like that's an immediate disconnect in my mind [00:39:00] because there is no way in our business the way that we're structured today, that I could serve that person to the level that they want to be served by an owner. So those are some of the disqualifications that you could maybe think through. Um, and then if they make it past your gate, so to speak, then like you said, you can bring another technical person into it. You can bring another owner into it after you've received some of the preliminary requests or things that check out to maybe make a decision [00:39:30] on whether they are a good client or not. So you've talked through, um, kind of the phone tree, if you will, which we don't. We don't get that many prospect calls. Um, we get a lot more through email referrals from our referral partners or existing clients, or we have website traffic. So let's talk a little bit about what we do in an email situation and who gets that first email from either a prospect [00:40:00] or off the website.

Rachel Dillon: Yeah. So form submissions off the website, come directly to myself and then any referrals that come through. So referrals actually come to any of our team members, to all of our team members, because they actually hold relationships with the clients. So when it's client referrals, um, you know, our client service manager might get it, a CFO might get it, a controller might get it. They all come to me to respond and to follow [00:40:30] up. And so that one just keeps it consistent that I know I'm saying the same thing to every single client, communicating the same information out. But also, I know that I'm responding. I know that I'm responsive within 24 hours to that referral to at least get them a meeting on my calendar. So a lot of times, if it's an email, I will respond back. I give them two of our web pages. Typically, I give them our plans [00:41:00] page that shows what our plans are and pricing. And then I also give them our team of three page to let them know how they are going to be served. Um, but in addition to that, that's usually at the bottom of the email. The top of the email is always my calendar. So I give them my calendar to book, and then I give them those two pages so that, you know, if they're unsure of like, I don't know if I want to take 30 minutes of my day to talk to this person I've never met before, they can look through and see some of the important [00:41:30] things about our, um, about our firm before they even get on the call with me. So, yeah, so through email is usually pretty good, because then we can set up a time that works for both of us. I send them a calendar link so that they can choose a time. I know the times on my calendar work for me and then they can find one that's convenient for them.

Marcus Dillon: Yeah. So a few important things there. You've set up email templates where they're saved, signatures where you're not retyping [00:42:00] this all every time it comes up. And then the other thing you mentioned is your calendar for prospect conversations is aligned with the hours that you want to take those calls. And so whether they get to that calendar link directly by submitting a form on the website, and automations are built in different things to where they can get that calendar, choose a time that works for them that cuts down the back and forth of hey, does this time work? Does this time work? All that that used to happen. [00:42:30] Um, so building out those automations. And then the other piece, um, that you mentioned is the website. So the website for us is a is a pretty important thing. Um, we we no longer support a, um, an office building necessarily, like we occasionally will go to an office, but we our business, we don't get walk in traffic, we don't get people that drive by and stop in. So those prospects aren't [00:43:00] happening. Our phone number isn't on the side of a billboard or on the side of our office, so our website has to be just as good a front door as a brick and mortar office could be. So with that, we've had to invest in our website, and a lot of people ask us questions about our website. So you want to give a little bit of background about that and what it's built on.

Rachel Dillon: Yeah. So our website is built on a CRM, HubSpot. And that's not necessarily that [00:43:30] every accounting firm has to go purchase a CRM and build a website on that CRM. Um, for us, that gives us a lot of data, a lot of tracking, and a lot of automation capabilities is part of the reason that we chose that. Um, for example, a prospect can go to our website, fill out a form, I get the notification, and then they immediately, without me doing anything or even knowing that I've gotten [00:44:00] the email notification, can book on my calendar. Uh, so that really helps because like we mentioned, um, on earlier in this episode that our clients aren't hanging out during normal office hours online or driving around. They're in their office. So a lot of times this is happening after hours, um, which works out perfectly that they can schedule and do all the things. They even get a follow up email from me saying thank you for scheduling so they feel like, right. They're getting the communication [00:44:30] and the feedback that they need a prospect needs just from our website. The other thing that we did on our website one, making sure that branding matches what we want people to, um, walk away from our business knowing and also feeling.

Rachel Dillon: So all of those things, just one in the esthetics of it, but two in how it works and the information that they can take away. So we included videos of who's a right fit, who's [00:45:00] not a who's not a fit. What will happen if you put your information into forms, what our onboarding process looks like. So there's a lot of videos on there. That way, even before we've had any direct interaction with someone, they're already getting value from what we're providing, which is what we want in the at the end of the day, we want someone to walk away better than when they came. And so even if it's our website and even if they disqualify themselves [00:45:30] from our services based on, um, the type of service, their type of industry that they're in or based on, maybe just price alone, that they just don't have the, um, revenue to support our monthly service fees. They still walk away better because they didn't waste 30 minutes on a conversation with me to find out this wasn't a good fit for them. So yeah.

Marcus Dillon: So so we've incorporated video on our website in your responses to clients. [00:46:00] Maybe there's a video there welcoming them, um, to that process. The other thing that you kind of mentioned is the disqualifiers that we're pretty clear on in those videos. Um, what happens, it seems, is whenever you do actually talk to that person over team's video or zoom, um, they feel like they know you because they've already met you virtually through video. Um, they have probably watched other videos on our website and either sold themselves [00:46:30] to take the next step or disqualified themselves. And if they disqualify themselves, they don't want to spend time their time, um, on a, on a call with you, potentially buying something that they don't want. So I think those are those have been helpful for us and where we're at today. And you mentioned not every not every firm is going to need a website built on HubSpot. And I think that there are plenty of good alternatives out there. You know, you've got the templated websites [00:47:00] that are very similar across the board and you can't stand out from your peers, but you can also invest in a custom built website that could be on HubSpot, that could be done on WordPress.

Marcus Dillon: They aren't too difficult to even build. I know Kinley, as a 16 or 17 year old, built her own website for Kinley's Confections on Wix.com. And so I think, um, one thing we see a lot of times is peers want what we [00:47:30] have and want to build it out just like we have, even though they may not do the services that we do. And so I would recommend a much more basic website and have only the services that you want to offer. Not all the services you do offer, but the services that you want to offer and the people that you want to work with because that's what you're going to attract. And so if you no longer want to do 1040 tax, take it off your website. And I think those are [00:48:00] some of the things. But we do 1040 tax. It doesn't matter. You don't need it on your website. So I think that's the piece where people kind of get confused on what goes on their website versus it being a postcard for their ideal client to visit and see what they could do with your office. So before HubSpot, what did we do?

Rachel Dillon: Yeah. So before HubSpot, we did have a form that people could fill out on our website. [00:48:30] It did come to me and I just had to manually respond, so saved signatures could still respond to those would have to send a calendar link manually for those, so it would just have to wait usually until the next morning. So it just wasn't automatic. It wasn't seamless like before. Um, but also in addition to that. So HubSpot, we mentioned that we use for like email marketing. And before that we used constant contact. So we just needed to have a way [00:49:00] to send mass communication out that would that could be automated, that could be scheduled, um, that could be tracked. So all of these features in some sort of process to be able to communicate in mass. So it doesn't have to be HubSpot, even though that's what we use now. Constant contact is what we use. Previously we used Hootsuite before Hootsuite was just to be able to post on multiple platforms, um, for social media. Now we use HubSpot. We can post [00:49:30] to any platform we want directly out of HubSpot. Again, they give us all the analytics and the tracking that goes with it. And so, um, and then also even a step further, um, previously and still some we have used ignition to be able to seamlessly send engagement letters and receive payments. Um, HubSpot can also do that too. So there's a lot of reasons. There are a lot of features on HubSpot that we wanted to use, [00:50:00] and we're using multiple different technologies, and to be able to consolidate that all into one place is part of the reason also, that we went with HubSpot and decided on a CRM and then chose to build our website on there. So all of those analytics, all of those automations live in one place and work together. But all of that can be accomplished outside of HubSpot as well. Uh, but giving your client and your prospect [00:50:30] a good experience when they're working with you, directly or indirectly is what all of these things, um, and what makes up a good kind of marketing engine for your business?

Marcus Dillon: Yeah. And you mentioned we use Constant Contact. There's also MailChimp, which is now owned by Intuit, which if you use, you know, all your clients are in Qbo. It could kind of serve as your CRM for that as well. And you're not having people in two different systems. Um, Hootsuite, [00:51:00] as as you mentioned, was what we use to schedule. And there's other options for those now, because it's been a while since we've even used Hootsuite, and I think there are plenty of different platforms. Um, if you go back to like The Office, I know Ryan, the temp came out with Wolf. Um, and Wolf would send you, you know, like all communications of facts, a text, uh, phone call, it was it was the greatest thing ever. But, um, there's got to be something else out there. So just what [00:51:30] we used years ago may not be the ideal solution now. And so whenever you're evaluating those things, it probably makes sense to look for automation. Maybe I just to make that process easier to where people either sell themselves or disqualify themselves based on what you are trying to serve them in the manner you're trying to serve them.

Rachel Dillon: Yeah, absolutely. Well, I know that this was so basic, and we only touched on a [00:52:00] very small piece. We didn't even talk through really email campaigns or social media or things like that, because the foundations that you need before you even get there and worry about that are so much more important for those types of communications to be effective. All of these other things are so much, uh, more important and will make those way more successful if you have those in place first.

Marcus Dillon: Yeah for sure. Well, thanks for [00:52:30] leading the conversation. Thanks for what you do on a daily basis, leading this effort for DBA, and appreciate you speaking to the audience on everything you know.

Rachel Dillon: Yeah. Thanks so much. Talk to you on the next. Thanks for hanging with us to the end of another episode. Leave us a review with your thoughts, comments, and feedback on Apple Podcasts or Spotify. Be sure to subscribe to our podcast so you don't miss any future episodes. Join us again next week for another great conversation.